|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 16:31:25 GMT -5
The Raptors held their own for a few minutes, but their shooting is horrid today and trailed 32-26 after the first quarter. But the wheels came off in the second. Not looking good.
|
|
|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 16:40:09 GMT -5
What happened to Pascal? He was a legitimate All NBA candidate at one time. But now, he’s really lost it. There was a sequence in the first quarter where he kept turning the ball over, lost it on fast breaks and generally killed the team. 12.5 PER with points, rebounds and assists per 36 all down… and his steals and blocks per 36 have fallen off a cliff. Not a fraction of the player he used to be.
|
|
|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 17:29:45 GMT -5
Raptors cut the deficit to 9. At least they’re losing respectable now. Raps really have turned up the defense.
|
|
|
|
Post by freewheel on Nov 5, 2023 17:33:59 GMT -5
I'm watching this game but pretty half heartedly. Seems a bit like a death march. The Raps have never been in it. Down 12 to 20 the entire game.
They can't score against the Spurs size and winning via jumpshot is no hope at all.
Just as I write this they've suddenly cut the lead to 5 with a short burst of energy in the 4th quarter. Maybe some life?
|
|
|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 17:34:35 GMT -5
Barnes hitting his 3s is a great sign. Such an important part of his development. Raptors down 5
|
|
|
|
Post by freewheel on Nov 5, 2023 17:38:09 GMT -5
My feeling is that Siakam's numbers the last couple years have been inflated by extremely high use. Best player on a bad team numbers.
This is not to say there is anything wrong with him. He's really good but not 1st option skilled and probably best suited to being the third best player on a top team.
|
|
|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 17:42:48 GMT -5
My feeling is that Siakam's numbers the last couple years have been inflated by extremely high use. Best player on a bad team numbers. This is not to say there is anything wrong with him. He's really good but not 1st option skilled and probably best suited to being the third best player on a top team. That was my first thought, but that doesn’t explain the crash of his steals and blocks. Pascal’s advanced stats are down across the board. I think energy was a huge part of his game, but now that energy just isnt there. |
|
|
|
Post by freewheel on Nov 5, 2023 17:45:22 GMT -5
He's been treated like a first option for 2 seasons. Doesn't know how to adjust is my feeling. Not unexpectedly.
He may have to somewhere else to accept it.
|
|
|
|
Post by sandman on Nov 5, 2023 18:48:06 GMT -5
Tuned in and out of this one. Tuned in too late to see the momentum swing and the W.
Hopefully they build off this one. That Chicago loss set them back mentally I think.
|
|
|
|
Post by freewheel on Nov 5, 2023 18:57:41 GMT -5
Didnt deserve it but just barely managed to get it into overtime and played well in OT.
|
|
|
|
Post by haisan on Nov 5, 2023 19:12:01 GMT -5
So, basically, I love it when the Raptors start badly and hate it when they have a great opening quarter? Is that the lesson here? Lol.
Love this time of year, when little differences can totally swing perceptions. If the Raptors had lost, they'd be 2-5 and we'd be talking tanking and lottery. But 3-4 isn't bad at all, all things considered.
Now, if we can just trade Pascal and Gary for a good guard...
|
|
|
|
Post by freewheel on Nov 5, 2023 19:22:53 GMT -5
Weird that Darko keeps trying to shoehorn Mcdaniels into the rotation. He had 4 minutes of truly awful in the first half. He's scored 5 total points in six games.
Unless something dramatic happens soon hes going to join the long list of terrible Raptor free agent signings.
At least Porter is playing OK replacing McDaniels. He has no future here but maybe we can boost him into a trade asset. Just please be healthy at the trade deadline.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pseudonym on Nov 5, 2023 19:28:50 GMT -5
SCT BRN is Him. Best player on the floor and willed the tram to the win. They were utter trash in the first half. Darko actually seems to be the first step in building around him.
I actually do like Schroeder a lot. I think he's better than FVV - I'd take him if the cap space wasn't an issue. Dunno if he's playing over his head, but I don't think so.
Siakam has almost returned to bubble levels. He's been ass all season. FO still fumbled the bag, out of him and OG, you obviously gotta move Siakam, ideally for a good SG, but who the hell is out there - and who the hell is going to give up such a player for an expiring contact during a down year (so far) who will command a max? SCT BRN will be unambiguously better than Siakam by the end of the season and their skills overlap, as has been discussed by everyone, everywhere, all the time.
Now, Siakam isn't THIS bad. If he was just poor today instead of mostly wretched, the game doesn't go into OT. And I'd Barnes is a #1, the #2 is right there already. But would egos clash? Can that even work? If Barnes keeps up this shooting, it can. In theory, a high Barnes-Siakam pick and roll could be very efficient. In theory...
I think GTJ will be ok. Not coincidentally, Flynn looked like he belonged in the NBA, so GTJ played better. The new system should have Gqry grow in the long term.
I see the foundation being laid by Darko, but good God, I was in my feels watching this until the comeback.
|
|
|
|
Post by scully19 on Nov 5, 2023 20:52:00 GMT -5
What happened to Pascal? He was a legitimate All NBA candidate at one time. But now, he’s really lost it. There was a sequence in the first quarter where he kept turning the ball over, lost it on fast breaks and generally killed the team. 12.5 PER with points, rebounds and assists per 36 all down… and his steals and blocks per 36 have fallen off a cliff. Not a fraction of the player he used to be. I think a big part of getting the coaching job was your plan for how to use Barnes to his fullest. The system is really more centered around Barnes than Siakam so he's been missing out on focus. |
|
|
|
Post by scully19 on Nov 5, 2023 20:57:22 GMT -5
SCT BRN is Him. Best player on the floor and willed the tram to the win. They were utter trash in the first half. Darko actually seems to be the first step in building around him. I actually do like Schroeder a lot. I think he's better than FVV - I'd take him if the cap space wasn't an issue. Dunno if he's playing over his head, but I don't think so. Siakam has almost returned to bubble levels. He's been ass all season. FO still fumbled the bag, out of him and OG, you obviously gotta move Siakam, ideally for a good SG, but who the hell is out there - and who the hell is going to give up such a player for an expiring contact during a down year (so far) who will command a max? SCT BRN will be unambiguously better than Siakam by the end of the season and their skills overlap, as has been discussed by everyone, everywhere, all the time. Now, Siakam isn't THIS bad. If he was just poor today instead of mostly wretched, the game doesn't go into OT. And I'd Barnes is a #1, the #2 is right there already. But would egos clash? Can that even work? If Barnes keeps up this shooting, it can. In theory, a high Barnes-Siakam pick and roll could be very efficient. In theory... I think GTJ will be ok. Not coincidentally, Flynn looked like he belonged in the NBA, so GTJ played better. The new system should have Gqry grow in the long term. I see the foundation being laid by Darko, but good God, I was in my feels watching this until the comeback. well said, all of it. I concur everything. I wonder where all those who questioned Scottie last year are now? That guy is everywhere doing everything. Schroder needs that respect to. I said it last game I like him more than FVV too. He's way more dynamic on offense and fits this team better, and cost way less. |
|
|
|
Post by scully19 on Nov 5, 2023 21:11:02 GMT -5
Side note, that end of 4th call against Siakam was pure horseshit. The guy clearly dove forward, body movement matters and when it's unnatural and not lead by a push then it's clearly fake and they don't deserve any call ever. Calling the feet collision to be illegal but they are both allowed to go for a loose ball, if Siakam fell instead would it have been a foul the other way?
|
|
|
|
Post by zugzwang on Nov 5, 2023 21:49:55 GMT -5
[Obligatory acknowledgement that Barnes was amaze-balls in this game. It'd be weird to say anything else.]
When the Raps win, I get a break from fending off the fire-Masai madness on twitter for a day or two. (Which ain't easy with the roster construction...) So I will take the opportunity to be uncharitable to the guy. Just don't tell anyone.
In 2013, Masi tries to trade Lowry to the Nicks. The Nicks back out and Lowry goes on to completely change the Raps fortunes for the next several seasons.
Almost exactly 10 years later, in 2023, Masai tries to renew VanFleet's contract at a huge number. He fails when VanFleet takes an even bigger payday to Houston, and then as a contingency plan gets Schroder as a backup on a superior contract.
Perhaps once a decade, the gods smile on Masai and force him to make great point guard moves.
Also, my theory is Poetl still isn't well. He doesn't look nearly as crisp as he did last season. I think he's still sick or working his way into game shape. I still think he's a monster, but this still isn't him (yet). He's kinda average, looking gassed, and not impacting the game as much as I would hope.
My note for Darko is when your team is getting embarrassed that badly in the 2nd quarter, don't be afraid to give Boucher some burn. The dude plays twice as well when the Raps are losing, and three times as well when they're getting crushed. I get that he might not get that many minute this season, but that smelt like a moment to bring him off the bench.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pseudonym on Nov 6, 2023 11:52:43 GMT -5
Shout out to OG for guarding the ultimate longboi while draining a career high amount of 3s. Very valuable and hard to replace; the team is different and markedly worse when he isn't playing.
Also I like what I see from Gradey. He's got a very good feel for the game and had a good impact despite the shot not falling. I think we struck gold, but it'll take a bit for him to bloom.
|
|
|
|
Post by blueyoda on Nov 6, 2023 19:01:27 GMT -5
I am actually enjoying the Raps play inspite of the record and the struggles. Couldn't watch the game live, but went back to see the recording - I was really impressed with Schroder, not taking anything away from Scottie and OG. Those two - I know they always have the talent and potential - but when we got Schroder, I was thinking more of a serviceable backup and thankfully not overpaying FVV. But I must admit I didnt know he could bring such a wonderful balance to his game.
On a separate note, it might do both of them good if Pascal and Trent switch places in the lineup, at least for a bit. Never going to happen for a million (or many million) reasons - the only remote chance is if Siakam himself goes and asks for that to happen (which also is not likely due to many millions). But it may jumpstart them both and also help Gradey's game. The bench unit struggles to create and Siakam does not have the opportunity to create enough in this new-look offence. I know it will not happen, but still .....
Also, I like Darko's rotations for the most part - and it improves as the game goes on based on how the team is executing.
|
|
